+1
Not posting driver design details isn't necessarily 'hiding' something nefarious, just common business practice of protecting their intellectual property.GM
With any manufacturer I've had dealings whether audio related or otherwise that has modified a product for a specific customer with its own special part # and said customer wishes it to be so, then it is till told otherwise.
Obviously, at some point someone will probably post its details to compare to stock, but for now it seems they don't want us to know for whatever reason, which is rightly their prerogative.
GM
Obviously, at some point someone will probably post its details to compare to stock, but for now it seems they don't want us to know for whatever reason, which is rightly their prerogative.
GM
Don't get me wrong---diysoundgroup has EVERY RIGHT to hide their product's specifications if they so desire----just I have every right to bitch about it, post my objections, and NOT buy their product.
But, enough of that, and back to the meat of this thread---I have heard that Hawthorne Audio has joined an Eminence Beta 10-CX with a Radian compression driver. Does anyone know if that is true? How well does that combination fare?
But, enough of that, and back to the meat of this thread---I have heard that Hawthorne Audio has joined an Eminence Beta 10-CX with a Radian compression driver. Does anyone know if that is true? How well does that combination fare?
i think its based on the beta, with custom specs that probably made it worse. the 15" silver iris are the worst speaker design iv ever purchased, and no change over 10 years. so stay away would be my recommendation! diysg are much more properly designed.
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" the 15" silver iris are the worst speaker design iv ever purchased"
What specifically did you not like about the Silver Iris? It's components seem to be top-drawer--the Radian 475PB tweeter is rated highly in pro audio circles, and I'm guessing then that the 15" woofer is an Eminence? Perhaps the crossover is poorly implemented?? Was it too harsh, too 'tubby', poor bass----????
What specifically did you not like about the Silver Iris? It's components seem to be top-drawer--the Radian 475PB tweeter is rated highly in pro audio circles, and I'm guessing then that the 15" woofer is an Eminence? Perhaps the crossover is poorly implemented?? Was it too harsh, too 'tubby', poor bass----????
explained a bit more here
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/172747-could-hawthorne-silver-iris-used-enclosure-4.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mult...ial-speakers-more-popular-19.html#post3521004
the radian driver may be good when its correctly implemented, that is with a waveguide and proper crossover. in this coax? not so much. the xo is ridiously high and the woofer runs fullrange. the polar response is horrible and the woofer beams and distorts very obviously.
take a look at the components of their $800 passive pair xo, all they did was superincrease the price of the components while the system does not work. they even have a a series resistor on the CD only, no paralell (!)
im pretty sure the high qts woofer sounds worse than stock eminence, and the only upgrade on it over the PSI version is the frame.
they make no sense. while i still had them standing around i build some cheap econowave`s and 3 way horn speakers. they really showed how poorly designed the PSI silver iris was.
the eminence tweeter was god aweful regardless of what i did with an active xo. sure the radian would be better, but also hugely much better with the right crossover and a matched waveguide.
over on their forum its the same nonsense every year. "they are supersmooth musical, never harsh etc" its all nonsense, they dont have a clue what they talking about becasue they clearly have not tried any good speakers. you can count me in as not being a fan.
other designers actually try to improve their products and see what the competition does. i cant imagine hawthorne has done anything, like reading a simple book on speaker theory for example. its a just subjective nonsense.
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watch this guy get the runaround, the speaker was the problem all along but the response is damaged tweeter, limited flac streaming support, poor electronics, breaking in crossovers (!) etc. quite funny.
Hawthorne Audio • View topic - Not satisfied with my hawthorne solos
Hawthorne Audio • View topic - Not satisfied with my hawthorne solos
with a rolloff this high and no waveguide support it still wont work. the woofer starts breaking up before 1k, and would also beam after that. already it does not handle midrange very good, yet is asked to play way into the treble.
eminence discontinued the 15 coax, most others have purpose made waveguides in them from factory, to match dispersion and lower the crossover to decrease distortion.
check out the off-axis collapse of these 2way speakers with 12" eminence and waveguide (hawthorne will be worse)
Econowave - looking for a tube friendly dynamic speaker? - Page 10 - DIY Audio Projects - StereoNET
i guess im in the wrong thread because i hate coaxials. but if i were you i would stay far away from hawthorne.
eminence discontinued the 15 coax, most others have purpose made waveguides in them from factory, to match dispersion and lower the crossover to decrease distortion.
check out the off-axis collapse of these 2way speakers with 12" eminence and waveguide (hawthorne will be worse)
Econowave - looking for a tube friendly dynamic speaker? - Page 10 - DIY Audio Projects - StereoNET
i guess im in the wrong thread because i hate coaxials. but if i were you i would stay far away from hawthorne.
Openly Baffled.....
Yes, I know the Beta 10cx is a poor choice for an open baffle but they turned up and my workshop is closed for 2 weeks and I couldn't help myself.....
So, cardboard, gaffer tape and paper fasteners to the rescue. Voila! Instant OB so I can at least listen to them.
I elected to try them out in the Eminence endorsed arrangement with an ASD1001 and the PXB2:2K5CX crossover and bought 4 sets as a trial run.
The crossovers are the best made I have ever seen.
So how do they sound? Well, it is a speaker with a QTS of 0.39 in an undesigned OB. So, weak bass extension is a given.
They sounded appalling when I first started them up, midrange shrieking like a banshee and a top end that was soft and hard at the same time. The sinking feeling we all know and dread - have I backed a dud?
Well, they got better of course. They still only have a few hours on them, and I am not yet sure they are quite 'Hi-Fi' in terms of stored energy and HD but there is no denying they are very efficient and seem to have tremendous dynamic range and resolution of detail. What bass there is, is very tuneful with great pitch definition which gives me hope for the MLTLs I plan to put them in.
I will report back after they have run in a bit more (hoping the midrange shout continues to abate and the tweeter smooths out).
blakkshepeaudio
Yes, I know the Beta 10cx is a poor choice for an open baffle but they turned up and my workshop is closed for 2 weeks and I couldn't help myself.....
So, cardboard, gaffer tape and paper fasteners to the rescue. Voila! Instant OB so I can at least listen to them.
I elected to try them out in the Eminence endorsed arrangement with an ASD1001 and the PXB2:2K5CX crossover and bought 4 sets as a trial run.
The crossovers are the best made I have ever seen.
So how do they sound? Well, it is a speaker with a QTS of 0.39 in an undesigned OB. So, weak bass extension is a given.
They sounded appalling when I first started them up, midrange shrieking like a banshee and a top end that was soft and hard at the same time. The sinking feeling we all know and dread - have I backed a dud?
Well, they got better of course. They still only have a few hours on them, and I am not yet sure they are quite 'Hi-Fi' in terms of stored energy and HD but there is no denying they are very efficient and seem to have tremendous dynamic range and resolution of detail. What bass there is, is very tuneful with great pitch definition which gives me hope for the MLTLs I plan to put them in.
I will report back after they have run in a bit more (hoping the midrange shout continues to abate and the tweeter smooths out).
blakkshepeaudio
Attachments
Maybe you are hearing the peak in the mid that comes from the typical OB response. It's directly related to baffle size. It needs to be equalised ( preferably actively) or accounted for in some way.
I have a CX10 with ASD1001 on a smaller baffle.Eminence crossover. I really don't hear any mid range shout ! But mine does need EQ for the LF . Maybe you should measure the response. I will but haven't got round to it. The CX12 audibly has more LF extension on a slightly larger baffle than the CX10. But I thought the mid on the CX10 was preferable.
I have a CX10 with ASD1001 on a smaller baffle.Eminence crossover. I really don't hear any mid range shout ! But mine does need EQ for the LF . Maybe you should measure the response. I will but haven't got round to it. The CX12 audibly has more LF extension on a slightly larger baffle than the CX10. But I thought the mid on the CX10 was preferable.
You could well be right ashok. I have very limited experience with cone driver OBs.
I am sure the 'hyper-flex' cardboard construction doesn't help either.
There are just too many variables at this stage to make much of a call - I won't bother to measure them until I get them in a proper enclosure.
Early signs are encouraging and I couldn't help but share my alcohol assisted enthusiasm with like minded prototypers !
I am sure the 'hyper-flex' cardboard construction doesn't help either.
There are just too many variables at this stage to make much of a call - I won't bother to measure them until I get them in a proper enclosure.
Early signs are encouraging and I couldn't help but share my alcohol assisted enthusiasm with like minded prototypers !
Well, I was heavily leaning toward purchasing an Eminence Beta-10CX with maybe a PSD-2013 tweeter. I would still like to try this; however I found a new-old-stock Radian 5212 Coaxial for $75 that I just couldn't resist, so I'm going with that. I seriously don't know if it will be any better than the Eminence; it seems to want a bigger box per WinISD.
what you describe here is very typical indication of a way to high crossover. its the same for all stiff spider PA woofers i have used. but as soon as i get it low enough the "break-in" period is gone with the wind.
Here is something I did with the Beta 10cx's little brother, the 8cx (same motor, btw).
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...-aperture-z-baffle-dipole-19.html#post4377787
It's a dual Beta 8cx Z-baffle dipole with compression driver on one of the drivers, and a Karlson aperture for slot loading and for deep bass extension for a dipole.
It sounds really nice, and happens to be quasi-transient perfect with a miniDSP XO.
That's my advanced foam core-triple-ply-foam core sandwich construction (3M 777 adhesive on all with latex caulking on baffle for CLD).
Impulse and Step Response:
Sound Clip - Have a listen (change .asc to .mp3):
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/atta...-aperture-z-baffle-dipole-kazba-beta8cx-2.asc
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...-aperture-z-baffle-dipole-19.html#post4377787
It's a dual Beta 8cx Z-baffle dipole with compression driver on one of the drivers, and a Karlson aperture for slot loading and for deep bass extension for a dipole.
It sounds really nice, and happens to be quasi-transient perfect with a miniDSP XO.
That's my advanced foam core-triple-ply-foam core sandwich construction (3M 777 adhesive on all with latex caulking on baffle for CLD).
Impulse and Step Response:
Sound Clip - Have a listen (change .asc to .mp3):
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/atta...-aperture-z-baffle-dipole-kazba-beta8cx-2.asc
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